Gemma 0:15
Welcome, everyone. So it’s Gemma here with you today. And I am ever so excited to connect you with our guest speaker. Amy Wyhoon of Sugarpop Social, who’s a Facebook and Instagram strategist specialist. And she’s been helping standout brands in digital marketing for the past four years. Did I say that correctly?

Amy 1:08
Pretty much.

Gemma 1:13
So first of all, welcome. So good to have you here.

Amy 1:17
Thanks for having me.

Gemma 1:18
You’re so welcome very, very excited. So let’s pop into our short introduction. And first of all, tell us what it is you do.

Amy 1:29
Well, obviously, it’s changed over the four years. For right now I’m helping online course creators, coaches and service providers get their offerings in front of the right people and make some money.

Gemma 1:42
Wonderful. We’re all here to make some money, right?

Amy 1:47
Ideally, so we can spend it right?

Gemma 1:49
Yeah! We wanna make it to spend it but we need to spend it to make it.

Amy 1:54
Yeah.

Gemma 1:56
So tell us what are your qualifications?

Amy 2:00
Well, I don’t have any official marketing qualifications. But I have been working in social media for four years and have studied quite a few courses regarding that. Facebook obviously have their Blueprint. And then there’s lots of other amazing, wonderful teachers out there so I’ve soaked up lots of knowledge. And yeah, I’ve decided that this is the path that I want to explore further.

Gemma 2:28
Wonderful, this is it for you. I love it. And what about your past working life then?

Amy 2:35
Oh, well, there’s lots of things in there. So from office management and hospitality management, I’ve ended up in social media. So yes, so your hospitality sort of has always been in there. And then obviously, after having kids, it was a easy one to get sort of some casual work in. And then it just kind of- kids got a little bit older, I was still able to keep it flexible, like with casual shifts and work around the kids. But I moved into a management position and then started marketing the cafe. And that led into the whole, it was sort of around the time that social media started getting really big for the food industry. And all those you know, Master Chef was big. So yeah, it was kind of like a good time. And yeah, I fell into the world of social media.

Gemma 3:28
Wonderful, and you love it.

Amy 3:30
I do!

Gemma 3:32
As I know, and tell us a bit more about who you work with.

Amy 3:39
So I’m working with a lot of business owners that have courses, either it might be a launch coming up, or some products that they want to get out there. And yeah, we’re just running some Facebook ads, like campaigns to get them out, find their audience, and yeah, connect them with the right people and get sales.

Gemma 4:05
Wonderful, I love it. And, of course a little bit more about what brought you to work for yourself, which you touched on a little bit before. But,

Amy 4:14
Yeah, so I obviously, fell into the world of social media. I was running sort of the social media for a cafe that I was working in. And the owner had a few other cafes and restaurants. So they sort of went “do you want to do it for all of them?” And so I started really researching, doing some courses, learning from some of the people that were really doing really well on Instagram at that point. So we’re talking like four years ago now. And yeah, it kind of got to the point that I was doing a lot of, I suppose, running of different accounts, and I thought “hey, there’s an actual business in this.” And so I decided to go out on my own, set up a little business and then life kind of had other plans. But yeah, like obviously I was gonna talk to my employer at that point. But yeah, things happen in my personal life and I was in hospital for a little bit and I ended up leaving my job and it kind of was, I suppose, kind of good timing that I had sort of set this up in the background so I just kind of went from there.

Gemma 5:36
Wonderful, oh good on you. That’s what we love to share, growing business.

Amy 5:41
Yeah.

Gemma 5:45
Tell us a little bit about you. What do you love?

Amy 5:49
Well, food. If you don’t know, I’m actually a food influencer.

Gemma 5:55
Are you really?

Amy 5:57
Yeah, over at @inbetweendeserts. So it’s dessert and everything in between and that sort of came about from running the social media for cafes and restaurants. I decided to get on the other side and see what that was about. Because obviously, there are lots of people. So I connected with people that way, and then brought them into the cafe. Yes, so that was kind of a bit of a crazy ride. Yeah, I’m also a very fussy foodie.

Gemma 6:29
I would imagine so.

Amy 6:30
And I love a good coffee. But @inbetweencoffees was taken or I think I was looking for like @inbetweenlattes. So we went @inbetweendesserts because I also have a bit of a sweet tooth. So I’m a mum of two boys, a six and an eight year old that certainly keep me on my toes. And I also love a good wine, which obviously comes back to the foodie thing.

Gemma 6:59
Well, we all love a good wine here at Work Wife Wine Time.

Amy 7:03
Yes. We should have been doing this in the afternoon with our wine.

Gemma 7:08
Right? Right. Why didn’t we do that? That’s okay. That’s really exciting. I love that. That’s awesome. So you’re absolutely definitely a social media expert by the sounds of things, right?

Amy 7:24
Yeah, I’ve dabbled a lot.

Gemma 7:28
I love that. That’s so cool. Yes, I will have to investigate your influence later. I can’t believe I didn’t know that.

Amy 7:37
Don’t go looking if you’re hungry.

Gemma 7:40
Okay. Good idea, I’ve just had lunch so maybe I should hold off a bit. That’s awesome. Anyways, we are here to talk Facebook ads today.

Amy 7:57
Yes, it’s scary, scary stuff.

Gemma 8:00
Right? So thank you so much for being here for it because Facebook ads, I know, they are extremely scary. And really overwhelming, right? It’s such a new world, and a different world, and a big one.

Amy 8:18
Yep. And ever changing as well.

Gemma 8:21
Absolutely. I’ve been running ads and you’ve been doing them for me, of course, because you’re amazing. For the past, what, three months or so now?

Amy 8:31
Yeah, we’ve been doing a few different things, haven’t we?

Gemma 8:33
Yeah. But even the changes within that three months has been astonishing. So you need someone to keep on top of it, that’s for sure.

Amy 8:43
Yes.

Gemma 8:44
So I guess let’s start first, then, with what are Facebook ads? Tell us.

Amy 8:52
Okay, so Facebook ads. So basically, it’s advertising on Facebook. It’s taking out some of the real estate on Facebook and getting your product in front of all those people that are scrolling through their newsfeed.

Gemma 9:09
Wonderful, awesome. Sounds simple doesn’t it?

Amy 9:15
That’s the simple version.

Gemma 9:18
So then, why Facebook ads? Why are so many people choosing Facebook ads for growing their businesses?

Amy 9:26
Yes. So I think especially like at this time of year like q4 is like the big time. All the big companies have their budgets ready to just pump out, you’ve got black friday coming up, Christmas. You know all the sales at this time of year. So there’s a lot of marketing right now on Facebook, but I think people choose Facebook to advertise on because it’s a quick way to get in front of people. Yes, it can be competitive. But it’s also a quick way, and you can see the stats, you can see the data, like if you bought an ad in a newspaper, which is less and less these days, you don’t actually know how many people are reading it, you have no stats on that. Whereas, you can actually see it happening in Facebook, although there have been lots of issues lately. But there’s a lot going on in America, with the election, there’s a lot of changes. So anything that goes on in the world, Facebook, all the social platforms can make changes to the algorithm to change things. And artificial intelligence, there’s a lot of that within Facebook ads at the moment, and that’s just being overly cautious at the moment. So you really need to make sure that everything’s compliant. And that you’re doing the right thing by Facebook right now. Otherwise you may find your ad account suspended or shut down, disabled. And yeah with staffing, and everything going on in America, it’s taking a little bit longer than the usual 24 to 48 hours to get things back up and running.

Gemma 11:15
Right, okay, can you explain a little bit more what you mean there by artificial intelligence?

Amy 11:21
Yes. So, bots. So Facebook, everyone would have heard of the Facebook algorithm. So it’s like, putting all the information into the computer and making it work. So that happens as well with Facebook advertising. And it’s got artificial intelligence scanning things. So it scans the ads, looks for words, so it’ll pick things up depending on what’s in there. If you’re not being compliant by a policy. It’ll have flags that it picks up on, so it’s just making sure that everything is– rather than one person doing it and sitting there doing it. It’s actually computerised now. And they’re getting smarter.

Gemma 12:09
Yeah, right. Before there was an actual human sitting there doing it?

Amy 12:13
Oh, look, I’m sure. It was still some kind of face, like a computer programme. Um, but yeah, it’s just smarter. Like everything, you know, our phones are getting smarter. So are all the programme intelligence, they’re getting smarter as well.

Gemma 12:31
Yeah, absolutely. And do have a bit of a, maybe an insider understanding as to why they really are tightening up on things at the moment?

Amy 12:43
Look, right now, you would have heard, there’s a lot of things with the election, and obviously, the last election. So there are changes being made to the algorithm to stop false information coming out and having impact. So I think that’s just having a flow on effect through everything right now.

Gemma 13:03
Yeah.

Amy 13:05
And hopefully, next week everything will be back to normal. And then you’ve got Black Friday sales, so then everybody will be jumpy. There’s always something, so it’s just knowing what’s going on at the time.

Gemma 13:19
Absolutely, I guess we’re not too far off from Black Friday sales, hey?

Amy 13:24
No, they are just around the corner. Three weeks.

Gemma 13:31
Wonderful. It’s super interesting. Really, really is. I think for me, personally, coming from a traditional media, if you want to call it that, background, television ads for many years and newspaper ads, I think the main thing for me is the data you can collect to actually see how many people specifically are clicking on your ad. How many people have viewed the ad then viewed the landing page, the clicks, the buys, the whatever, the data, to me, is astonishing.

Amy 14:09
Yep. And you can change it if it’s not performing the way you thought it might, you can change it, whereas once it’s in print, or once it’s in television, you can’t do that. So that’s why it’s just such a different playing field.

Gemma 14:25
Absolutely. And I learned that personally as well. And you know, if you’re with the testing, if you’re testing two different copies, two different creatives, which ones are working better, if that one’s not quite working, you can jump in and change it around, and it’s amazing because once something’s printed in a newspaper, how do you do that?

Amy 14:48
Yeah, and you can also change it too, so you’re giving like a slightly different creative and message to who you’re talking to. So you might have two slightly different audiences, you can’t do that in print. Because you can’t decide who gets to read it. You don’t know that information whereas, Facebook and, once again coming back to that, Facebook smarts and the artificial intelligence. They’re able to collect all this data that actually says, ‘Oh, they like this.’ And you give them a particular message that hopefully resonates with them. So it gets them into the product or whatever it is the service that you’re offering.

Gemma 14:49
Yeah, absolutely. Isn’t that amazing?

Amy 15:05
Yeah.

Gemma 15:05
Just touching a little bit more on that, when we’re looking at selecting audiences and things like that, what sort of demographics can you tap into in Facebook?

Amy 15:48
Yeah, look, there’s lots of options. So obviously, you’ve got age. So you can select what age group, whether you want to target like men, women, or both. One of the good ones for ecommerce is that you can actually target engaged shoppers. So that’s a really good one if you’re looking for something particular and then people that are also shoppers on Facebook, that can sometimes boost up your sales, because you’re actually getting people that want to buy from the platform. Yeah, and then you’ve got all the different interests. So, there are some interests that you would think might be available that aren’t. But there’s also your entrepreneurs, your business owners, you can actually target people that are Facebook page admins. So yeah, there’s lots of different things. One of the ones that really got me which I didn’t realise at the time, you can target people that have upcoming birthdays. So providing that they’ve put their correct birth date into Facebook, you can target them and you can target anniversaries, people with upcoming anniversaries. Some of the stuff’s like, ‘Whoa, that’s really clever.’

Absolutely. Imagine being ecommerce and then targeting someone with an upcoming birthday. That’s incredible.

Yeah, well I had a lot of cafes going, ‘We’d love to offer you a birthday gift, come in and get a free meal.’ And I was like, ‘Wow!’ And my birthday month!

Gemma 17:32
Who wouldn’t do that? If you’re scrolling through and you see that, ‘Come and get a free coffee!’ I’m there!

Amy 17:40
I thought that was very clever marketing. For all these cafe owners out there.

Gemma 17:47
That’s incredible, wow. I’ve certainly learned something new today.

Amy 17:58
There’s just lots in there.

Gemma 18:00
Yeah, it’s incredible. So, let’s, considering I’m a copywriter, let’s delve into a little bit here of the importance of good copywriting for Facebook ads, because they are of course, a combination of creative and the copy. Absolutely. But, what would you say is the main importance of really good copy for your ads?

Amy 18:28
Writing to the pain point. So, really capturing the attention, what is it that’s going to stop your ideal audience in their scroll? So, it needs to be scroll stopping. So what is it? Is it the image that’s going to capture them? Is it the copy? Obviously, with copy, there’s all different, your short, your medium, your long form. So different lengths of copy, the text that goes above the image on Facebook, you only see like a couple of lines before it has the three dots to click for the more. So sometimes it’s really just getting those right words at the top end of like your message that work with your image to make someone go ‘That!’ and click, and then keep reading. So, I really think that it’s a bit of working it together. And then obviously, good old testing. Test, test and test again. Yeah, just testing which one is working for your audience.

Gemma 19:41
Absolutely. So you mentioned the short and long copy there, can you explain that a little bit more?

Amy 19:50
Yes, so obviously, short copy is your sharp, get to the point, grab the attention. Medium copy is a paragraph, so it just explains a bit more, you’d have to click the three dots to keep reading. And then your long copy, so that could be three, four paragraphs, it’s kind of just however long it takes to get the message. And in the long copy, you’ll often see a testimonial. You know, it might be a bit more of the sales page. So what is it that you’re actually going to get here? Once again, it would always start with that sort of capturing headline, to start off the copy to get them to click to read more. So you still need to have the bit at the top that’s going to get them clicking through that sort of attention grabbing scenario that’s making them read more.

Gemma 20:51
Absolutely. And do you have a suggestion or an idea of when long copy works with those few paragraphs, as opposed to your very short copy?

Amy 21:07
Yeah, look, it does just depend, I think it depends, too, on what it is that you’re offering. So obviously, the higher the price point, sometimes more information is better. So you know, they want to know, before they’re clicking through to find out to buy that $500 course that you’re selling, they might need that little bit more information at the front end. But once again, it’s a matter of testing it and working out what people are actually clicking through on. Because there’s no point just going ‘Oh, look, you know, it’s got to be long copy here,’ because if you don’t try the short copy, you may be losing sales.

Gemma 21:47
Absolutely, wonderful. For those who may be looking into Facebook ads for the very first time, do you have a suggestion of how many different ads you should test to start to see what’s working on what’s not?

Amy 22:09
It really comes down to budget. So the more budget you have, the quicker you can do the testing. $10 an ad is sort of minimum. So if you’re thinking, ‘Okay, I need to try a short copy versus a long copy,’ that might be a testing option, then you could go $20 a day. So if you have two– a copy, short copy, long copy, $10 a day, test that. Then you might test different images with the winning copy. And then you can start mixing in headlines. If you just, ‘this is what I’ve got, I’ve only got $10 a day,’ just try it. If it works, then you might go, ‘Okay, this is the ad that I want to run,’ test audiences then. Try testing different audiences, so you might put $10 on one audience set and $10 on another audience set. So you’re looking at like $20 a day. Obviously, if you can bump that up, you are going to get results a lot quicker, and see what needs changing, if anything needs changing, a lot quicker.

Gemma 23:19
And how sort of long do you think, I know it could be dependent on the industry, the business, but how long should you do your testing for before you may be able to see what’s working?

Amy 23:32
Yeah, so you need to test it so it reaches enough people. So yeah, once it’s reached 1000 people, you should be able to work out whether it’s working or not. And whether it’s worth scaling or if it might need– like you might want to change something up again, to see whether something might work better. So you’re sort of looking at your, CPM, and your reach.

Gemma 23:59
Okay, and for those who don’t know what CPM is?

Amy 24:02
So it’s cost per million. And you don’t want that to go over the $40 mark. So it’s basically the better that is, generally means that your ads are performing well.

Gemma 24:15
Okay.

Amy 24:17
Yeah.

Gemma 24:18
Fabulous, good to know! So for me, I write a lot of Facebook ads for clients myself, and I have been getting a fair few rejections and having to tweak and change the copy to push it through like what we were talking about earlier. And I’m very interested to hear your take on using the word ‘you’. So as a copywriter myself, that is almost 101 of copywriting, right? It’s something I learnt many billions of moons ago, back when I was in uni. But what’s changing about using the word ‘you’ now in Facebook ads land?

Amy 25:04
Okay, so I think from your perspective, you would use ‘you’ to call out your reader. So that when the audience is reading it, they’re like, ‘that’s me.’ What Facebook doesn’t want, is they don’t want people to be singled out. So by using ‘you’, and then putting something next to that that puts them in like a box, they don’t like that. So you can use ‘you’ can carefully throughout your copy, but you don’t want to use it to call people out. So for example, if I was running an ad, for course creators, I could say, ‘hey, course creators, do you want to blah, blah, blah.’ That sounded good, didn’t it?

Gemma 25:58
Absolutely!

Amy 25:59
Yeah, but I wouldn’t say– now, I’m on the spot here.

Gemma 26:05
Okay, what about something like, you know, ‘hey, course creator, are you struggling to make money?’ I’m trying to think–

Amy 26:13
Yeah, see money’s another big no no.

Gemma 26:15
Yeah, I’m trying to think what I’ve had rejected. So I found an issue with me is when I took the word feel out. Because, you know, ‘do you feel like this?’

Amy 26:31
Yeah, no that’s a big no, no.

Gemma 26:32
Right? Because I found that telling or putting that person in a box of ‘are you feeling this?’

Amy 26:41
Yes.

Gemma 26:41
So that’s a big no no.

Amy 26:44
Yeah. You don’t want to put people in a box, like a great example would be, ‘do you feel like, you’re always tired? You can’t get out of bed?’ Like you’ve created that whole, ‘Do you feel?’ And all of a sudden, unfortunately, people are in a box. Whereas, you could twist it, get rid of that, and, ‘feeling tired?’ You also can’t make claims. So you don’t want to make any, especially medical claims, like, ‘this will fix your back!’ you know, ‘make $10,000 in 30 days!’ That’s another big one, no money. Facebook will flag a lot of copy for multi level marketing. They’re definitely against that. So if it reads like, you might be trying to get people in to make a quick dollar. That’s a big one. So I will often have to get the manual review request for that. But I’m getting better at– because obviously, my clients don’t do that. They’re actually using social media tools in their business to create programmes that actually work. And yes, so it’s just learning and knowing how to rewrite the copy to get around that.

Gemma 28:19
Yes. Absolutely. And I get why they’re trying to do it. It is it is a good thing.

Amy 28:27
Yeah.

Gemma 28:28
Yes, to wrap your brain around it.

Amy 28:32
And Facebook is a very– they want people to have a positive experience. So if you can make it a positive, I suppose, scenario over the negative, I find that that’s definitely looked upon better in general, like organic and paid.

Gemma 28:51
Okay, yeah, fantastic. So we’ve touched on the world of copy, one of my favourites. What about then the importance of good creative?

Amy 29:05
Well, look, they’ve made some changes recently to creative, getting rid of the text rule. You used to only be able to have 20% of text in your image. However, they still encourage you not to have more than 20% because they believe that that performs better. So even though you’re allowed, doesn’t mean you should.

Gemma 29:05
Interesting

Amy 29:30
Yeah. And I think too people prefer to see– you can have that little bit of text and then a nice capturing image that puts people in that picture, puts you in that scenario, or shows you who you’re going to be working with. Or if it’s a product, it shows how that product can be used. Rather than just an image sort of thing. I feel like we want to be in that experience to show– if you’re spending hundreds of dollars, you want to know who you’re spending it with and you want to go, ‘Yep, I think I could get along with them’ kind of thing. If it’s a product, or a service, show me what I’m going to get. Is it five spreadsheets? You know what I’m trying to say, just have that image that captures the attention. Like, it doesn’t have to be specifically graphically designed, lots of people are using Canva. And I love Canva. Yeah, totally jump on board on Canva cuz there’s so much fun stuff in there, but be careful, it’s a rabbit hole.

Gemma 30:48
It’s a rabbit hole!

Amy 30:54
Good, creative, obviously does– they work hand in hand the copy and the creative.

Gemma 30:59
Yeah! So, you know, basically for example, you have a digital lead magnet perhaps on an ad showing that sort of image of, you know, the cover and the six pages?

Amy 31:15
Yeah! I suppose this year, particularly, a lot of people have gone to creating online courses and a lot of people have been using the mocks. So like a mock up of the– if it’s a course scrolling through the course on the little mock up of the computer screen, in their image. So creating, a little video from it, or just having all the different things sort of laid out in an image, ‘you get this, and this and this kind of thing.’ So that’s obviously showing the value behind it. And then I always say, let’s test that with an image of you. Let’s test that with something completely random. Just to see whether that works better, or people want to connect more with you. I had one recently where the brand, the person, worked better. Then another one, the mock shot worked better. So it’s just dependent on the offering, and the audience that you’re reaching. And if it’s a cold audience, I find that they generally want to see who you are.

Gemma 32:26
Yeah, of course.

Amy 32:27
So once you’ve warmed up, it’s then–

Gemma 32:29
And, a cold audience is?

Amy 32:31
A nice segue! So a cold audience is reaching people that have never heard of you. So you’re targeting them via location, via interests. And they haven’t necessarily crossed paths with you at all yet. And then as they get to know you a bit better or they interact with your ad, they interact with your Facebook page, Instagram account, then they become a warm audience. And then of course, your hot audience are the ones that are ready to buy. They’re on the edge of their seats going, ‘Come on. When’s it coming out?’

Gemma 33:08
‘When is it? I want the thing!’

Amy 33:10
Yeah. We like hot audiences.

Gemma 33:13
I guess it makes sense with the cold audience that they would want to see you right? Because they’ve never–

Amy 33:17
Yeah, they don’t know who you are.

Gemma 33:23
That’s awesome. Awesome. So then, what can all of these Facebook ads, what can it do for a business? Once we’ve done–

Amy 33:38
Oh, it can do a lot. So once everything’s like set up in place, and you’ve tested and you’ve found the audience that’s working, then you’ve found the creative that’s working and getting the sales, then you start scaling it. So you start putting more money into it to get more sales from it. You start fine tuning it to get a better return on your investment. So obviously, the more you put in, you want to get more back. So you don’t want to be paying $2 to get a sale of $2. Unless, of course, you’re trying to build an audience to sell something bigger to. So there’s lots of different ways that ads can be used for your business. At the end of the day, you want to set up a system that’s going to work if you’re looking at an Evergreen course, then you want to set up an Evergreen funnel. And if you want to set up something to create, like, ads to create a list, you want to build your list. So then you start working out ways to set ads to do that. So you always have to have that end goal in mind what you’re looking for, and then set the ads up, get the ads working and then start scaling them, find new audiences, you know, every now and then you’ll have to update the creative because creative can fatigue. So it’ll get tired, people’ll be like ‘I’ve seen is 20 times.’

Gemma 35:06
Okay.

Amy 35:07
You know?

Gemma 35:08
Make sense.

Amy 35:08
They don’t always want to see the same things, but then it might be recognisable. So you’ve just got to keep an eye on it. And that’s why a lot of ad managers will be like, ‘you check them daily to see how they’re going. Make sure that nothing’s fallen off or stopped working.’

Gemma 35:25
Very, very in depth.

Amy 35:27
It’s a big process. Yeah, it is.

Gemma 35:30
Absolutely, but there really is success stories of businesses growing.

Amy 35:35
Absolutely. I mean, just recently, I had a launch with a client, and we were one sale short of goal. But, we did it and it was a two week turn around. Quickest launch. And I was like, ‘Wow, this is awesome.’ So yeah, we’re all excited about it. So, yeah good results.

Gemma 35:58
Yeah, that’s fantastic. And what about one thing that is quite deep in my heart, is the importance of like, really intimately knowing your target audience and your avatar, so that one person you’re speaking to, so you can really market your ads effectively?

Amy 36:21
Yeah, well, that comes out, I suppose, like, if you know, what your target, what you’re targeting, who you’re targeting, the creative light is targeted towards them, the copy is talking to them. And then it’s finding them within Facebook. So you go into, like the audience insights within your business manager. And you’re, you know, you’re popping like something about them. So you know, they might be female, they might be age 30 to 35. And, you know, you might go and they like this, pick one thing, and then you start layering it and seeing like, Facebook will actually spit out a list of things that they’re, you know, people within Facebook that like this in that age bracket in that country, also like this, okay. And then you can start finding other things that you may not have necessarily thought of, to target. And this is really handy, if like, your audience isn’t converting the way that you want it to, you might need to go looking like it’s something a little bit different to see. And it could just come down to adspend. Like, you know, for example, a lot of creative entrepreneur businesses, courses, coaches, they target the interests of people that like Amy Porterfield, or people that like Marie Forleo. A lot of people target this audience. So then you’ve got to go, Okay, well, if you know, there’s, you know, all these people targeting that particular audience, how does your stand out? You know, is your budget big enough? Maybe the budgets not enough to get yours in front of that audience. So then you have to maybe think outside the square and go, Okay, what other people might this audience be into? What other things we know? Where do they eat? What you know, what websites do they visit? What books do they read? And then see if they’re targetable options?

Gemma 38:23
Wow.

Amy 38:24
So yes, definitely knowing your audience intimately, like knowing what they do, you know, where they live, all that sort of stuff comes into play, but you may also need to think outside the square a little bit in the targeting. I think knowing them definitely helps with your creative.

Gemma 38:41
Yeah, absolutely. I love thinking outside the box. So, that is awesome. Yeah. So what about some tips for our lovely listeners today. And I’m thinking tip number one would probably be testing.

Amy 39:08
Test, test and keep on testing. You can’t like you can never really test too much. Because, you know, if you test one thing, unfortunately, Facebook does change and sometimes testing it, you know, three months later, you may get a different result. And you know, you’ll have also learned as well, so Facebook will have learnt and you’ll be able to see from the data and go Okay, well, maybe if we tweak this and see if that works better. You know, like, yeah, definitely test. One of my favourite words.

Gemma 39:43
Just test. Yep.

Amy 39:45
Yeah, keep testing. Also another big tip is to make sure that your business manager is set up correctly.

Gemma 39:55
Okay.

Amy 39:57
So business manager, I have had so many clients come to me with problems. Yeah, just make sure it’s set up correctly. If you’re running a business manager just for you with just your business account in there, make sure you own it, make sure it’s the primary page, so nobody else can claim it into their business manager. Because it is really hard work trying to get it back.

Gemma 40:23
Wow.

Amy 40:24
Yeah. So and turn on two factor authentication, so nobody can hack your account.

Gemma 40:32
Wow.

Amy 40:33
Not so much ad related, but it’s definitely the foundation. Because once Yeah, once your ad account’s gone, it’s really hard to get back and even if you do get it back, it’s, it’s generally flagged, so anything that you do on it just causes problems. So just Yeah, look, after your account, set it up right and then yeah, Test. Test have and also, you know, make sure what you’re planning to sell, obviously, for ecommerce it’s a bit different, but because I’m dealing more with course creators and service providers, you know, make sure that your product or your course has kind of been qualified. So that, you know, there are people out there talking about it, you know, getting excited about it, so that, you know, the ads that you run, they’re working towards something, you know, list building, then of course creating, Yeah, little offers.

Gemma 41:33
Yeah, right. Absolutely. Okay, so the main part of today, test.

Amy 41:41
Test and test

Gemma 41:43
And set up correctly. And test.

Amy 41:48
Pretty much.

Gemma 41:52
Amy, that was fantastic, I dare say, so, thank you so much for that.

Amy 41:57
Thank you for having me.

Gemma 41:59
Such amazing information, in this episode today. Yes, so tell us, where can people find you?

Amy 42:10
I am on Facebook and Instagram @sugarpopsocial. I have a Facebook group ‘Make Your Social Media Pop.’ And website is sugarpopsocial.com.au.

Gemma 42:23
That’s wonderful. Now where does Sugar Pop Social come from? Sugar Pop? Why?

Amy 42:28
Yeah. So In Between Desserts was my food blog and because I was mainly dealing with cafes at the time, I wanted something, I suppose a spinoff from that. And yes, so sweet. Soda would have been all of our initials. But it was too close to another business that was similar in a similar niche. So we went with Sugar Pop, it kind of tied in with– we wanted something with social, so Sugar Pop Social, yeah. It just it worked. And it came from yeah, in between desserts so a bit sweet. Sweet and sweet.

Gemma 43:03
Absolutely. And make it pop. That’s it. Love it. It’s wonderful. And finally, so we’re all about collaboration over competition here of course. Um, how has embracing that helped your business?

Amy 43:25
I don’t see a lot of people like I mean, look at my business has, like expanded, pivoted, it’s not really the right word, but you know changed direction a little bit. Because obviously, I was quite into Instagram. And then Facebook, I did some training on Facebook, just to learn how that worked for the organic side. And then I really dived into advertising and just loved it. So yeah, look, I will often, you know, I have people that I refer ecom client inquiries to because I’ve decided that yeah, I just want to focus on this. I don’t do social media management anymore. So I have people that I you know, refer on to for that. And then obviously, just, you know, building up your network, because everybody does something a little bit different in digital marketing. It’s just such a big playing field. So you know, you’ve got people that do SEO, you’ve got people that do websites, you know, strategies, like you know, tech strategies, that sort of thing. So there’s lots of different people. And yeah, it’s just building up that I suppose it’s more of a network, isn’t it? It’s not so much of you know, they do what I do, it’s, you know, we’ll look, hey, I’m full, but this person is really good at what they do. You know, I’d be happy to refer you So yeah, I think it’s definitely a good thing to have connections. And yeah, there’s a lot of people out there. They’re like, I feel like the less you worry about what’s coming in it just happens. I think people can tell, like if you’re if you’re in that space of like, Oh no, I just feel like you know, something happens and things shift and it doesn’t flow the way you want things to flow.

Gemma 45:20
Love it. We should all embrace it right?

Amy 45:23
Yeah.

Gemma 45:25
Awesome. So again, I can’t thank you enough. Thank you so much for being here with me. It was wonderful.

Amy 45:30
Thank you. Thank you for having me, Gemma.

Gemma 45:33
You’re so welcome, anytime. Please come back! So ladies, that is a wrap. Thank you so much for being here this Friday. And as always, all of you kick ass women and fellow work wives. Remember, you’re not alone, because like we just said, collaboration is power. And most importantly, we all get it.